Some good points binokular ... had to do some thinking about those. I think the fact that "charty" has a negative connotation is not just because of the way people use it but rather that of late it's content has been a reflection of lots that is negative about modern music. I agree that things are picking up , there is nothing wrong at all about creating music that is popular in fact that's the way it's been for hundreds (thousands?) of years. In fact it's why we have a chart to quantify what's popular. Yes people sometimes do take it too far but to say that it's indie or alternative types is not strictly true what's the difference between Damon Albarn saying "I make this music for me etc." and some pre-fabricated boy band attempting to convince us that they are really into songwriting and have a huge input in their music ? I agree with your point on the "ease" of songwriting and I retract that statement :-), anyone who writes with an audience in mind constantly crosses that bridge. I've nothing against R&B or dance music and most definatley not pop music. However I do have issues with the fact that currently it's hard to hear anything else on major channels or radio than R&B , and I'm not convinced that that's because the record buying public actually like it , it's more likely that some (not all) have been duped into buying this music to be hip/cool/square , take you pick by the massive marketing / media campaigns you spoke of , I'd just like to see some of that spread around , i.e. when dance music was at it's heyday (in chart sales!) it was the exact same. Perhaps this is always going to be the case but I for one am looking forward to the swings and roundabouts so that things can level out , we get an equal blend and people can then decide for themselves which genre or genres they like the best , and not necessarily at the exclusion of others. I guess one way of starting this would be to have more independent radio stations like phantom on air / with licences. phew , rant finished , I too have had too much coffee today !!!

Hi JMC, was wondering when you'd show up, hows things? Yes, the term chart music has negative connotations, I'm saying it shouldn't. It reeks of elitism. Boybands and "manufactured" pop are often rubbish and bland, but that doesn't mean that they can't deliver the goods from time to time. Why be so dismissive? You know, the Sex Pistols were essentially a manufactured band, the brainchild of Malcolm Maclaren. This "ooh, they're manufactured pop" thing is rubbish, again indie kids running for the high ground. Great manufactured bands of the past: The Temptations, Jackson 5 (and much of the motown label), the Monkees, etc. Just because things seem a bit grim for manufactured pop at times is no reason to dismiss the format. You said credibility is when a "number of particular people to like you. these are the connoiseurs, the experts, whose opinion carries weight among others. for example, journalists, and musicians who already 'have' credibility, can bestow credibility through the media" Very true, I agree with you, sounds like runs the risk of being dangerously close to snobbery and elitism doesn't it? Thats not to diminish the role of the music press, hey, I write the (very) occasional review on Cluas myself so I guess that makes one of the Dark Lords Henchmen too (Eoghans gonna soooo kill me ), and it would be nice to think that someone would read one my reviews and value my opinion, but its just an opinion, same as anyone elses. So to answer your question about being credible and popular, yes they can, look at Radiohead. Eternal critics darlings (odd article excepted) and healthy record sales. I have two theories why backlashes happen. One is a journalist wants to make a name for himself and appear clever by knocking over some sacred cows, the other is that journalists get a bit bored of a partcular artist. Imagine the situation, a poor scribe sits at his desk contemplating his latest assignment "Ah nuts, the Editor wants me to do ANOTHER feature on the Frames, righto time to start a backlash so I can write about something else for the next six months"