morello New Member Posts:72  
| 2/13/2004 1:11 PM |
|
|
Here's the facts:
This week Morello sold (as the relevant shops confirmed) over 200 CD's between Tower and Road alone, 124 in Carlow, 72 in Waterford, 40 in Mullingar, 40 in Dundalk, 150 ( ish ) in Monaghan and 46 in Killarney plus whatever went out the door on Thursday.
Niall did a check with all the shops on Wednesday, had a count of 683, and asked the dude from Chart Track what would that have gotten us this week: he replied No. 6
All the shops were eventually sold out:
We sold something between 700 and 800 copies of which only 249 were recognised. Actual position in the charts: No. 20 - unofficial No. 4
This happened because most of the shops in which we had the biggest sales (including Tower and Roads) weren't picked up in the random selection for this week.
I understand the system works the same for everybody but only a major distribution deal would allow a band to have their CDs in ALL the shops.
Also, a sample is supposed to be "representative".
This system penalised our sales of a 60/70 %
Now, is this fair?
Your thoughts please
Alex
|
|
|
|
Binokular Veteran Member Posts:1665
| 2/13/2004 1:23 PM |
|
|
Taking a representative sample seems like a rubbish system, most record stores have computerised tills, surely there must be some way of keeping track of all or nearly all records sold in Ireland?
Might be interesting if someone started an "unnoficial" chart, taking internet and mail order sales into account too.
|
|
|
|
Dromed Advanced Member Posts:900
| 2/13/2004 2:06 PM |
|
|
That's s**te Alex, sorry to hear that, you must be disgusted. I'm presuming that the shops you had your CDs in outside of Dublin were all barcoding the cds when being sold? That random selection is a load of balls.
|
|
|
|
morelloNew Member Posts:72
| 2/13/2004 3:29 PM |
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dromed
That's s**te Alex, sorry to hear that, you must be disgusted. I'm presuming that the shops you had your CDs in outside of Dublin were all barcoding the cds when being sold? That random selection is a load of balls.
Yep, all the shops were chart registered and (I suppose) all the sales have been scanned.
Unfortunately though, many of these shops werent picked in the "random" selections..... this means that, unless you have a major distribution deal (so that your CD is in EVERY shop), you must be pretty damn lucky to get your CD up in the charts..... which is, as you rightly said, a load of balls coz it penalizes the independents!
However, we made it in the Top 20 so f**k them! :)
A. |
|
|
|
flagman Basic Member Posts:150
| 2/13/2004 4:39 PM |
|
|
So, let me get this straight. You only need to sell 250 singles to into the top 20?
Not belittling which is a fine amount of sales or anything, I always had the idea that it would be a lot more.
Explains the tripe that usually is found in the chart, I thought there were thousands of people buying crap records!
This is the proper toppa most of the poppa most chart you're talking about here?
|
|
|
|
ursosackedNew Member Posts:5
| 2/13/2004 5:15 PM |
|
|
Yeah..I too am suprised and shocked at that! obviously unfair count for the account of some mainstream crap. Its a warped system.
But 250 sales to get to top 20! Thats alright if you're distributing it independently too, so well done!
It sure ain't easy for the indies!
|
|
|
|
Vent My SpleenAdvanced Member Posts:500
| 2/13/2004 5:29 PM |
|
|
Unbelievable! You bust your hump trying to push ans promote your record in the shops you know attract poeple of a discerning musical taste only to take it up the ass from all those idiots buying Justin TImberlake in Golden Discs.
Go Morello! I shall be buying you single this very weekend. Consider it a show of solidarity.
|
|
|
|
devondudleyNew Member Posts:3
| 2/13/2004 7:05 PM |
|
|
Thats bull thats not the way the charts work shops are not included in the chart if under imro are not deemed to be properly connected to music like gift shops and such,thats the only way shops are not included in the chart.Random picking of shops for charts sounds crap and if thats the case thousands of albums and singles each year are sold and not recorded that sounds bull s**t i reckon you gor it wrong
|
|
|
|
irishunsignedNew Member Posts:18
| 2/13/2004 8:11 PM |
|
|
Hey Alex, and everyone else.
There are a couple of clarifications that need to be made here, and having been "studying" IRMA, Chart Track UK and the entire charts system for almost 18 months, I think I know how most of it works.
And, as those who know me will appreciate, I am not a fan of the system but equally I am not a fan of misundertstandings that become urban legends, and accepted truths!
First, there is not a "random" selection procedure. Effectively, Chart Track uses normal telephones to 'poll' the machines they have installed in approx 275 stores nationwide, most of which are independent stores (not in a chain, like Golden Disks). They estimate that at any week they can get approx 80% of the data back. It is in the 20% of the missing data that any 'mistakes', deliberate or otherwise, can be made.
Second, any store that sells a range of music (ie must sell current releases, to be honest), can be a chart track store. They do *not* have to be a record store (Easons, for example, sell chart CDs).
Third, if Chart Track stores told you that they sold 650+ units, yet only 250+/- were recorded, then this is *WAY* beyond the missing 20% they would normally expect to see.
My recommendation, as it was to Gigsmart last year when they were stiffed themselves, is to ask the stores to mail you a sales-list. You are entitled to know the number of units they sold for you as you are entitled to payment for them.
If their systems (ie not people, but the same machines that chart track 'polls') tell you they reported 650+ then you have a news story of National level on your hands, and I have some people who may well be interested in publicising it.
In the meantime, ask Chart Track for a per-store list of data received. They will likely refuse for data-protection etc. Then, send them an email of the list you got from each store and ask them who is 'wrong'. The trick is to try to get them to tell you which stores they didn;t get any data from, and then check the system logs at that store.
We (IrishUnsigned) have been waiting for someone since last year, to get a proveable news story out of this charts scam that goes on all the time.
Oh, and we are working on an entirely new chart so if you (any of you) have friends who work in record retailers (of any kind) and would like to contribute to the new (fair and open) charts, then tell them to get in touch with us.
And, if you're an expert in Java programming, we want to ehar from you :-)
Alex, give me a call/mail if you want to go further with this.
In the meantime, I am going to contact the MD of Chart Track (John Pinder) and let him know, as I always do, about the 'shortcomings' of their system.
Ron, IrishUnsigned
|
|
|
|
markwhiteNew Member Posts:15
| 2/16/2004 7:48 AM |
|
quote:
Originally posted by irishunsigned
Hey Alex, and everyone else.
There are a couple of clarifications that need to be made here, and having been "studying" IRMA, Chart Track UK and the entire charts system for almost 18 months, I think I know how most of it works.
And, as those who know me will appreciate, I am not a fan of the system but equally I am not a fan of misundertstandings that become urban legends, and accepted truths!
First, there is not a "random" selection procedure. Effectively, Chart Track uses normal telephones to 'poll' the machines they have installed in approx 275 stores nationwide, most of which are independent stores (not in a chain, like Golden Disks). They estimate that at any week they can get approx 80% of the data back. It is in the 20% of the missing data that any 'mistakes', deliberate or otherwise, can be made.
Second, any store that sells a range of music (ie must sell current releases, to be honest), can be a chart track store. They do *not* have to be a record store (Easons, for example, sell chart CDs).
Third, if Chart Track stores told you that they sold 650+ units, yet only 250+/- were recorded, then this is *WAY* beyond the missing 20% they would normally expect to see.
My recommendation, as it was to Gigsmart last year when they were stiffed themselves, is to ask the stores to mail you a sales-list. You are entitled to know the number of units they sold for you as you are entitled to payment for them.
If their systems (ie not people, but the same machines that chart track 'polls') tell you they reported 650+ then you have a news story of National level on your hands, and I have some people who may well be interested in publicising it.
In the meantime, ask Chart Track for a per-store list of data received. They will likely refuse for data-protection etc. Then, send them an email of the list you got from each store and ask them who is 'wrong'. The trick is to try to get them to tell you which stores they didn;t get any data from, and then check the system logs at that store.
We (IrishUnsigned) have been waiting for someone since last year, to get a proveable news story out of this charts scam that goes on all the time.
Oh, and we are working on an entirely new chart so if you (any of you) have friends who work in record retailers (of any kind) and would like to contribute to the new (fair and open) charts, then tell them to get in touch with us.
And, if you're an expert in Java programming, we want to ehar from you :-)
Alex, give me a call/mail if you want to go further with this.
In the meantime, I am going to contact the MD of Chart Track (John Pinder) and let him know, as I always do, about the 'shortcomings' of their system.
Ron, IrishUnsigned
GO Ron! |
|
|
|